(LifeSiteNews) — On this episode of Faith and Reason, John-Henry Westen, Father Charles Murr, and Frank Wright discuss Pope Leo XIV affirming the Church’s teaching that Judas excluded himself from eternal salvation, famous Hollywood actor Denzel Washington saying he would advise his younger self to “pray more,” Trump saying during an interview that he would like to try and get to heaven by making peace in Ukraine, British pro-life activist Isabel Vaughan-Spruce being investigated by police a third time for silently praying near an abortion center, and more.
The panel began the episode by discussing Pope Leo’s remarks during a recent weekly audience in which the pontiff affirmed the Church’s constant teaching that Judas was damned for betraying Our Lord. His predecessor, Pope Francis, had sown confusion on this teaching multiple times during his pontificate, infamously saying he “didn’t know” if Judas was saved during a 2020 homily.
READ: Pope Leo affirms Church teaching that Judas excluded himself from salvation
Murr first reminded the faithful of the importance of knowing the faith and the Catechism so that they aren’t confused if a pope or another prelate makes a statement that contradicts the Church’s teaching.
“I thought it was ridiculous, and (Pope Francis was) bizarre for saying it, but it didn’t throw my faith into any quagmire at all. I was just fine, because I know what my faith is,” the priest said.
“Let (the Church hierarchy) say whatever they want to say; it doesn’t matter. It doesn’t matter because the truth remains the truth,” he added.
Murr further stressed that he’s glad to see Pope Leo undoing some of the harm from Francis’ pontificate.
Wright also welcomed the Holy Father’s correction and emphasized that confusion about Catholic teaching, such as Judas not obtaining salvation, ultimately arises from modernism.
“Modernism is a cult of the self, and specifically about personal revelation, your personal desires, your fantasies, your imagination, displacing the real world,” the journalist said. “Unfortunately, what modernism does when people take it seriously is it doesn’t reveal anything and reveals actually everything about the person having the revelations and the limits of their own desires and their imagination.”
“(Modernism) often leads to ridiculous conclusions that give you a sensible chuckle, where you realize that these things, these little revelations, that people entertain in their modernist fantasies, have absolutely nothing to do with the changeless Magisterium of the Catholic Church, whose excellent wisdom is indifferent to this kind of nonsense,” he added.
Later in the episode, the panel turned to news from the U.S., where President Trump, during an interview discussing his administration’s efforts to end the Russia-Ukraine war, said he wanted to “try to get to heaven if possible.” Trump noted that he’s probably “at the bottom of the totem pole” for going to heaven but expressed hope that his efforts to make peace in various conflicts would help him be saved.
READ: Trump says ‘I want to try to get to heaven’ while discussing Ukraine peace efforts
“He’s got a lot of work to do, particularly in the Israel department, for sure, because that’s just weird,” Westen noted.
Wright noted that Trump appeared to demonstrate sincere humility in this interview despite often being referred to as “orange Hitler.” The journalist then underscored that this is a good reminder that being rich or powerful doesn’t get one any closer to heaven.
“It is … an astonishing reminder, before the world, some people would say, the most powerful man in the world, and certainly one of the richest, reminding us all that that power, that glamour, those riches, don’t get him an inch closer to heaven,” he said. “In fact, as he said, put him lower down the totem pole. I think this is an excellent reminder of the divine order of reality.”
Murr agreed that Trump’s desire to get to heaven seemed genuine, suggesting that some of his Catholic staffers had advised him that he’s at “the bottom of the totem pole.”
“President Trump, this second term, has surrounded himself by Catholics and by evangelicals (on) the White House staff. He listens to these people, he knows them, he sought them out, they give good counsel,” he said.
“And what I’m impressed with is quite a few, obviously, have told him he’s on the low part of the totem pole,” he added. “They’re not incensing his ego when you’re told (that) you’re at the very beginning and you’ve got a long way to go up, so he’s apparently listening.”
For more discussion on Trump’s hope of getting to heaven, Pope Leo correcting Francis’ errors on Judas’s salvation, and much more, tune in to this episode of Faith and Reason.
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